Nostalgia & History > Ice Boat on Flatcar

Here's another gem from the Minnesota Historical Society's files

Ice boat Lady Franklin on steel runners invented in 1856, being transported by rail.
Photograph collection ca. 1858
http://collections.mnhs.org/visualresources/image.cfm?imageid=199348&Page=1&Digital=Yes&Keywords=railroads&Type=Photo&SearchType=Basic
Location no. GV3.74 p19
Minnesota Historical Society

Markings indicate it was owned by the Prairie du Chein and St. Paul RR Line.

I'm also curious as to what is that device on the flat car ahead of it. Some part of a drive mechanism to be attached later?

-John

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I guess this was the substitute for a ferry across the Mississippi in the winter. Looks like it might have been able to run on thick ice on the river, on the water in the river, and on snow on the ground. Maybe the thing on the flatcar ahead of it was some sort of ice breaker attachment.

Prairie du Chien is at the confluence of the Mississippi and Wisconsin Rivers. John, maybe that contraption had to do with crossing the Wisconsin River.

The following from Wikipedia is interesting:

"Although the city was first connected to the Milwaukee & Mississippi Railroad in 1857, the width of the Mississippi River posed a challenge for further expansion of the railroad into Iowa. This problem was temporarily solved by disassembling the trains at Prairie du Chien and ferrying them across the river to be put back on the tracks on the other side. A better solution was found by Michael Spettel and John Lawler, who designed a permanent pontoon bridge to span the river in 1874."

Below are three a pictures of pontoon bridges at Prairie du Chien.

1. From the Wisconsin Historical Society

2. From Wikipedia dated 1885 photographed by Henry Peter Bosse

3. A more modern bridge from bridgehunter.com showing the bridge open. This is probably the 1910 replacement of the 1874 bridge.

Here is the caption to the first photo:

"Elevated view of the pile-pontoon railroad bridge across the Mississippi River at Prairie du Chien. The bridge was built and patented by John Lawler in 1874 and it solved the problem of providing railroad crossing of the Mississippi without stopping the river traffic. Prior to the Lawler bridge, the railroad cars were towed across the river on barges. The Lawler Bridge was 8000 feet long, crossing both channels of the river and an intervening island. It was constructed in two parts, the pile, or stationary part, and the pontoon or movable part, which consisted of two floating draws, one in each channel, which, when closed, form an unbroken track, permitting a safe and rapid railroad crossing. When open, the bridge allowed river traffic to pass with ease. The pile portion of the bridge was of ordinary railroad construction, but the draw over each channel consisted of one pontoon with a 12 inch draft. The Lawler bridge was replaced in 1910."


Marty Bernard



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/30/14 13:22 by MartyBernard.

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The first shot is absolutely the best shot that I have ever seen of "intermodal" railroading. Look at that RR headlight and bell! It almost could be mistaken for an early Gilderfluke.

Thanks for sharing!
-E.O.

hogheaded Wrote:
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> The first shot is absolutely the best shot that I
> have ever seen of "intermodal" railroading. Look
> at that RR headlight and bell! It almost could be
> mistaken for an early Gilderfluke.
>
> Thanks for sharing!
> -E.O.

What else would you expect, but from the Milwaukee and it's predecessors, an ice boat and pontoon bridges.

The Milwaukee had pontoon bridges at three locations: Prairie du Chein/Marquette, Chamberlain SD, and Wabasha MN.

Below is a pic of one of my "works in progress". My Milwaukee style pontoon bridge model. How's that for a disguise for an access?

-John

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And, here's how they worked.

Must have been a maintenance nightmare, frequent adjustments of track height to compensate for high/low water.

-John

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Man, all the jacking needed to put in and take out shims!


Marty Bernard

MartyBernard Wrote:
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> Man, all the jacking needed to put in and take out
> shims!
>
>
> Marty Bernard


I would imagine that in addition to the nearly daily adjustment for water level, there must have been, as with all movable bridges, an adjustment for rail creep.

-John

>My Milwaukee style pontoon bridge model. How's that for a disguise for an access?

Fabulous!

I saw (stupidly, did not photograph) the Marquette bridge exactly 40 years ago this month, and instantly wanted to model it. This may be the answer that I need to extend my model RR space out in the barn. If I modeled the bridge to scale, I ought to be able to drive a pair of beer trucks through the opening side-by-side without fear of spillage! Hmm, hmm..., now if I jack-hammered a hole into the floor for a pivot-post...

-E.O.

LarryDoyle Wrote:
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> I'm also curious as to what is that device on the
> flat car ahead of it. Some part of a drive
> mechanism to be attached later?

Appears to me to be the rear wheel and axle of a farm tractor, possibly with chains on. Tractor is sitting across the car for some reason. Edit: on closer look it looks like an iron tractor wheel with angle-iron sod grippers.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/30/14 23:01 by lwilton.

lwilton Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> LarryDoyle Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I'm also curious as to what is that device on
> the
> > flat car ahead of it. Some part of a drive
> > mechanism to be attached later?
>
> Appears to me to be the rear wheel and axle of a
> farm tractor, possibly with chains on. Tractor is
> sitting across the car for some reason. Edit: on
> closer look it looks like an iron tractor wheel
> with angle-iron sod grippers.

ca. 1858?

LarryDoyle Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm also curious as to what is that device on the
> flat car ahead of it. Some part of a drive
> mechanism to be attached later?
>
> -John


Here's a drawing of that ice boat. It appears that the "disk" on the flatcar may be the item that propels this steam powered ice boat when it's on the ice and snow (and maybe even when it is in the water). You can see the disk centered between the rear skies in this pic…



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/04/14 01:00 by Thomas.

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My question regarding pontoon bridges that open to boat traffic: How is that done mechanically? And how is something this large able to fight strong river currents, especially during its nearly closed phase when the movable span is exposed to such a wide section of river current?

Wow.

Thanks for finding that. What was the source of the drawing, and was there any other information?

-John

Thomas Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> LarryDoyle Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I'm also curious as to what is that device on
> the
> > flat car ahead of it. Some part of a drive
> > mechanism to be attached later?
> >
> > -John
>
>
> Here's a drawing of that ice boat. It appears that
> the "disk" on the flatcar may be the item that
> propels this steam powered ice boat when it's on
> the ice and snow (and maybe even when it is in the
> water). You can see the disk centered between the
> rear skies in this pic…



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/04/14 06:47 by LarryDoyle.

Thomas Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> My question regarding pontoon bridges that open to
> boat traffic: How is that done mechanically? And
> how is something this large able to fight strong
> river currents, especially during its nearly
> closed phase when the movable span is exposed to
> such a wide section of river current?


One corner of the barge was hinged to the pier, and swung like the gate in my model. There was a small pilothouse with a steam engine to drive the mechanism. One can be seen in my 3rd photo about midway down the length of the barge on the left. In the third photo Marty posted, a stack can be seen behind the far end of the barge. It seems all of them swung in the downstream direction.

By the way, the Titanic was not the first vessel equipped with transverse bulkheads which attempted, unsuccessfully, to prevent flooding of the entire hull. These 400 foot long barges also had such bulkheads.

-John



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/04/14 06:47 by LarryDoyle.

LarryDoyle Wrote:
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>---------------------------------------
> -----
> There was a
> small pilothouse with a steam engine to drive the
> mechanism.
>


So the steam engine drove a perpeller like a tow boat's?

Marty Bernard

It would seem that way, but I don't know how widely propellors were used as early as 1874. Paddles perhaps?

MartyBernard Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> LarryDoyle Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> >---------------------------------------
> > -----
> > There was a
> > small pilothouse with a steam engine to drive
> the
> > mechanism.
> >
>
>
> So the steam engine drove a perpeller like a tow
> boat's?
>
> Marty Bernard



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/04/14 16:03 by LarryDoyle.

Wow …a hinged, propellor or paddlewheel driven pontoon bridge? What a weird, yet wonderful, design!


LarryDoyle Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> By the way, the Titanic was not the first vessel
> equipped with transverse bulkheads which
> attempted, unsuccessfully, to prevent flooding of
> the entire hull. These 400 foot long barges also
> had such bulkheads.
>
> -John

As far as watertight bulkheads go, the Southern Pacific train ferry Solano, build in 1879, had them (I think 18 compartments) long before the Titanic.

Pic#1: SP train ferry Solano.

Pic #2: Solano wreck today

Pic #3: Two of the waterproof bulkhead structures (rough, crisscross walls).



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/04/14 09:48 by Thomas.

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LarryDoyle Wrote:
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> Wow.
>
> Thanks for finding that. What was the source of
> the drawing, and was there any other information?
>
> -John


There is apparently a booklet on this ice boat. The drawing is on the cover. Go to:

http://www.prairieduchienstories.com/archives.html


The booklet description states:

"The Lady Franklin is the story of Norman Wiard’a iceboat about 1860 when John Muir joined Wiard at Prairie du Chien to work on the invention. Later Wiard went east and Muir went west; both became famous. [32 Volume IV-2]"

Egads, THE John Muir, photographer?!

BTW, found additional info on this float bridge:

This site mentions this, as well as another, pontoon bridge…
http://www.johnweeks.com/river_mississippi/pagesA/umissAR08.html

This site has some spacific hisory and mentions that the bridge was swung using a steam engine and chains, instead of our propellor/paddle wheel ideas…
http://www.chippewavalleymotorcarassociation.ellawisc.com/history.html

If anyone finds additional info on that ice boat, please post. All of this is fascinating material.

Oops. Found these pics at http://www.rarenewspapers.com/view/605227?list_url=%2Flist%3Fq%255Bsearch_method%255D%3DAll%2BWords%2525q%255Btext%255D%3DLeslie%27s

I LOL'd when I saw these pics. This machine looks more "concept" than actual. I wouldn't have believed it existed had I not seen the flatcar pic.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/05/14 11:24 by Thomas.

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